Religion

[jackie87]

Hey boys and girls, I am sitting at uni wondering if our community is really that anti-religious. I myself am a former Catholic who attended church almost every week up until I was 14, when I found out I could not question my faith over matters regarding my sexuality and female reproductive rights, after confessing that I had touched someone "inappropariately" I was refused communion by some arsehole priest who possibly was upset he didn't get a piece of the action. Also, I don't ever think that people who I knew who went to church did it for reasons other than to appear like they were doing something good in their community, whilst still many were having affairs and divorces. I am now an atheist and reject the notion that there is a "God" as such and then again why should he be a "he".Anybody with similar experiences?

[avoninski]

I come from a mixed background (new Catholic/lapsed Jewish) and was refused my Catholic confirmation. Some religious classmates in junior high heard me saying in a conversation that I didn't believe in 'one true God' and that no religion was superior to any other. This was filtered back to their parents and then to the priest. I was refused communion, and have not returned to organised religion since then. Too much Dogma.

Is the gay community anti-religious? No. But are we anti-establishment? Yes.

[lucille]

I was brought up as a Catholic (sorry, I had no choice), and I reject the idea of organised religion. I do this because organised religion can be blamed for many of the world's troubles, not just now but throughout history.
The people who organise these organised religions spout ideas on loving others until it suits them not to love.
Also, I believe that organised religion is dominated by men and even the most fashionable and groovy of them (eg. Buddhism) treat women poorly.

[atomic-teddy]

I think i am maybe very anti-religeous, but im somewhat spiritual and i consider them the same as one another. My main concern with religeon is that once people get something in their heads they close it up to anything that contradicts what they think.
Some people just can't accept others - and thats both sides of the fence there.

[drmoreau]

A lot of the guys I'm friends with have been brought up in Christian private schools... And now they totally reject religion.

I hate to say it, but the more I reason religion to myself, I become a stronger atheist.

[alison87]

My mom was brought up Catholic and that pretty much turned her off it for life. I was christened Catholic but she made sure my sister and i never went to church after that. To be honest i'm really not too fussed either way about religion, as long as people don't try push it on you. I do believe there's stuff out there we can't explain yet, i guess i'm sorta spiritual, but i don't practice anything.

[atomic-teddy]

they reckon that people feel stronger about their religeon when they find that religeon, rather than be born into it. ^^ something to think about

[jackie87]

I was brought up as a Catholic (sorry, I had no choice), and I reject the idea of organised religion. I do this because organised religion can be blamed for many of the world's troubles, not just now but throughout history.
The people who organise these organised religions spout ideas on loving others until it suits them not to love.
Also, I believe that organised religion is dominated by men and even the most fashionable and groovy of them (eg. Buddhism) treat women poorly.

Thank you, I agree they are all dominated by men and the thing I have against Buddhism as they treat animals as "lesser beings", I would never consider my dog to be "lesser" than me that is the ultimate insult to animal lovers.

[ap_bcd]

I spent Many years in the Church by my own choice, nearly 20 in all. I moved form the Uniting Church through to the extreme Pentecostal movement. I spent time trying to Change my sexuality at my most extreme involvement.

I've since rejected the organised church in all its forms. I think there are some great teachings in many religions, however organised Churches are possibly the most destructive organisations in existance.

[Cheetah77]

I was never been pushed into religion by my parents thankfully - welll, apart from a few boring Sunday school lessons... and I am so glad for it!

Like everyone else here, I really rebel against organised religion and agree that no one way can be the "right way".

[Tim D]

I don't think this is something that is limited to the gay community.

A lot of people are spoonfed religion from a young age and are expected to swallow it all whole, simply because that is what past generations have done. But we are now at an age where we have access to every religion in the world at our fingertips and can critically pick and choose which parts we'd like to follow, and which we'd like to forget about.

I think organised religion is facing a pretty bleak future. And, to be honest, it's about time.

[taylor-dayne]

the church can EAT ME OUT.

i can see what it gives people, it's about community, giving meaning to the things we can't understand or know, gives structure, absolution, yada fucking yada...

but PLEASE. i couldn't be less convinced. and i kn0w i'm a good person who acts ethically and responsibly and i am loved by many people so that just goes to prove it to me.

i don't need an organised religion to tell me how i'm doing. i know. and i don't need approval from anyone but those i love.

[jackie87]

I am glad I pushed my parents out of religion but on the other hand my grandparents unfortunately are very good friends with George Pell and Tony Abbott, but I think they are too old to revert.

[GenesisInVain]

Hmm just on Buddhism, it depends on the interpretation of it, whether its Theravadan or Mayahana Buddhism. Therevadan Buddhism and Zen Buddhism are the only strands of Buddhism that 'discriminate' against women. I was raised a Catholic but I've rejected religion all together. The problem with religion these days are the extremists and fundamentalist, and yes I do agree that organized religions have a bleak future, its just the beginning of the end.

[jackie87]

It still annoys me how politicians in the US and Australia seem to always need to have a religion. Just look at both major parties, the religious right is taking over us now.

[skiwi]

Religion= root of all evil (hate, wars the list goes on)

[drewboi-78]

Religion= root of all evil (hate, wars the list goes on)

and the Richard Dawkins doco's of the same title shows the scary trend of increase in religious interest.

Also, what was even creepier was the doco "Jesus Camp" that follows the life of an Evangelist pastor who is building her very own Holy and Republican army of children - as young as 3!

What is funny is that extremely conservative and bigotted homophobe Pastor Ted Haggard (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Haggard), who appears in both these docos, was removed from his New Life Church after admitting to buying sex and meth from a male prostitute. Just about the same amount of hypocrisy we saw from Senator Larry Craig

[zebra-stripes]

Religion is as strong as ever. Bible belts in America are intense. Indonesia is closing down liberal Islamic groups at the insistence of the fundamentalists ones.

Youth Day is a fairly beneign, positive event. Yes the new laws are rediculous. But really we don't have much to complain about compared to other parts of the world. It's just fun and trendy to protest, I guess.

[dreadcircus]

I am a pagan or as the Catholics would say "A Witch" and am proud. Growing up religion was never in my house and I loved heavy metal music which back in the 70- 80s was predominantly about SATAN.

Since moving to Sydney in 2004 and meeting my partner I've followed the pagan path getting together with our core group of friends, doing rituals.. Yup the same rituals the Catholics stole when they burned people at the stake for opposing their doctrine. I have worked with Voodoo, Black magic and even taken part in some real full on rituals. The thing is with Paganism for me is its grounding. It's not nasty to women like most religions and it focuses on energy and healing even when dabbling in black arts.

I don't follow it like a religious nut case and must admit I have even borrowed stuff from other religions to make mine a personal one. The problem with so many religions is the forcefulness thrust upon us to convert. There are many things within these religions which are spot on but they all mostly contradict themselves to the point of ridiculocity.

I cant separate the difference between state and church these days anyhow, its become one. Apart from the endless wars and repression which has come from religion there is this ridiculous notion that GOD and SATAN are good and evil and we must choose. What a load of bullshit we live in a world which is magical because of the polar opposites for they bring balance...

Yes I'm rambling which I apologize for but this bullshit about not being able to protest has me pissed off to the max... I feel for some of the idiots who will feel my wrath during the Popes visit.. :)

[Bren]

I don't think this is something that is limited to the gay community.

A lot of people are spoonfed religion from a young age and are expected to swallow it all whole [...]

Astute observations, TimD :)

Social groups (eg. gays, women, the sexually abused) who have been traditionally shunned by autocratic and orthodox religions seem more keenly aware of religious hypocrisy and fallibility because they understand (through bitter experience and witness) the adversity and social inequality imposed by those religions under the guise of faith.

People often don't question things until they are pushed out of their comfort zone. If you were a married hetero and the Church tells you that you're the best thing since sliced bread bar none, why would you want to believe otherwise (unless you had a strong conscience that believed in "do unto others..")? It would be the truly selfless among them that questioned such an authority in those circumstances. And yet, there once was a guy in Nazareth, so they say...
.

[robbie]

I was raised Christian, R.E was part of my curriculum, right up to year 12. I learned a great deal about Christianity however as I discovered freedom of speech and thoughts outside of high school, I learned that my beliefs were more in tune with Buddhism. This isn't to say I shave my head, shove on the oversized curtain and go chanting on the weekends, but I simply digest PARTS of what the religion preaches and use it to live a healthier and happier life.

Religion has and will always be a part of the human race. People need something, someone to believe in, to make their life seem important, to give them courage, guidance, faith, hope.

There is a place for religion, as long as it doesn't involve removing the rights of, or hatefully inciting the demise of those that are different in any way shape or form.

[Snuff]

i wonder if i am the only person in this thread who is a practicing christian?
well i dont know if it's considered practicing when i only go to church at christmas but anyway... i grew up going to an anglican church but it was never forced onto me. my parents never made me go. for some reason i always liked it... even at the times when i have questioned the teachings of the bible and whatnot, and there have been alot, i have always found comfort in going to church. not for the sermons or the communion or the prayer because i can do all that from home if i want, but just for the sense of feeling like i belong there. although it's a little awkward, it's always nice to have all the old ladies come up to me after church and say how they remember when i was only this high and i used to cartwheel all over the place.

growing up i went to a predominantly (although they claimed to be non-denominational) assembly of god fundamentalist christian school where i was taught that it was not ok to be gay and that all other religions are wrong and all that other crap so i can understand why alot of people end up rejecting religion but along the years i have formed my own interpretation of it all and i believe what i think is right and all the rest of it i think is just exaggeration.
but i feel comfort in thinking that someone is watching over me and that not everything is my fault and that when i die i won't simply cease to exist.
i think i need religion otherwise i would feel like there was no purpose for me... and i like to think i have a purpose in life.

i did have a point to this post but i can't remember what it is and i'm just babbling now...

baby if you see this please don't get freaked out!

[RealMcCoy]

Religion is as strong as ever. Bible belts in America are intense. Indonesia is closing down liberal Islamic groups at the insistence of the fundamentalists ones.

Youth Day is a fairly beneign, positive event. Yes the new laws are rediculous. But really we don't have much to complain about compared to other parts of the world. It's just fun and trendy to protest, I guess.

Honey, I was protesting things before you were born, probably, and I certainly don't do it because it's "trendy". What you don't seem to understand is that these laws are so incredibly draconian and that if we let the government get away with imposing these laws, we may NEVER claw back our rights from them again! Pre-WWII Germany had the same sorts of laws imposed, and most of the people there said the same things about them that you are saying. You really should study up on history, honey, cuz if you don't, you may be doomed to repeat it.

As for my beliefs, I do consider myself to be religious, but I am more of a naturalistic pantheist (i.e., I believe that Nature is God/Goddess, and is not a "sentient" being, but simply a "higher power" over which we have little control).

I was born/educated/raised Catholic up until the age of 12, when I made the choice (fortunately, with the support of my parents) to go to public school and to visit other churches. I went to other churches throughout high school/college in my exploration of various religious beliefs, but found those churches were often filled with hypocrites. I formed my beliefs independently, and only later found out what "pantheism" was by finding it on the internet.

What I find particularly interesting is that many so-called "Christians" seem to believe that people who do not believe in their brand of religion have no moral compass. As though the bible is the only way they are able to tell "good" from "bad". I have to wonder about these people, that they seem to have no concept of morality outside of religion -- as though the idea of "treat others as you yourself wish to be treated" is somehow "owned" by Xtianity? WTF??

Anyway, that's my $0.02

[zebra-stripes]

Urm, yeah I agreed that the laws are stupid. But lol@nazi germany references.

[Chancethegardener]

I have nothing against people who find comfort in religion. In an anthropological sense religion has served a purpose in the past and will continue to do so in the future. Namely being it 'saves' (for want of a better term) a lot of people from throwing their lives away on all manner of forms of addictedness, what ever your vice may be. If it takes someone finding 'god' to get them off the gear, get them out from in front of that pokie machine or quit drinking excessively, then personally I think it serves an important purpose. I would very much like it if people could achieve these things without entertaining the possibility that there is some devine higher power steering them on the path to becomming a better person, but I suspect a shift as big as this in populus thinking will never happen in my life time.

I have an intense interst in epistomology, and the epistomologist in me says that the burden of proof in regards to what any of us believes as fact is very, very difficult to prove unequivocally. This is a weighty philosophical debate to enter into, but all I can say is that there is an incredible potential in most major organised religions to do good in world. Mosst of the time we merely get rehashing of old vestments and customs,organised religion hasn't changed much in the last few hundred years. But time and time again religion crosses into matters of policy, governance and ethics when it simply should not.

To predicate governmental decisions or legislation on the existance of an all seeing, all knowing and all powerful superior being runs the risk of ignoring the consequences it might have for real people, and their vastly different expreriences of life on this planet. Dictatorial religious doctorines are harmful to minorities and majorities alike. They detract from the diversity of human experience. They create in-groups and out-groups. Devision. Isolation. 'In these things you will find salvation.' That's dangerous organised religion.

While not agreeing with believers, I respect their opinions, and see much sense in a lot of what they believe ('Do unto others....,' who would disagree with that!?). When religiosity crosses over into influencing the lives of others in the form of governmental policy - abortion, gay marriage, contraception, morality - then I begin to have a problem with it. It ignores the consequences on those who may not believe, and that troubles me.

It is far betting to be a pragmatist or utilitarian than it is to be pious or dogmatic.

[Thrawn04]

I was raised a Seventh-Day Adventist. Basically they believe in the second coming of Christ and worship on Saturdays. They also promote vegetarian lifestyles. ;)
I've kind of silently slipped away... I still believe most of the SDA beliefs - I've just kind of neglected my relationship with God... :o It's just easier to forget...
I've kind of feel bad for admitting that... :(
It would be my belief (or closest thing to) that what matters is your personal relationship with Jesus/God. I'm quietly aware that I'm negleting it... So I'm not going to enforce anything...
It's ironic that my dad is an Irish Catholic. Though he's very tolerant about relegion. :)

Also some of the comments about religion being the root of all evil - I think human fallibility (sin) would be the cause... since religions are basically groups where like-minded people gather etc
My thoughts anyway...

[marly]

I believe that if there is such a thing as God that its a unique personal experience for everyone.
Im more inclined to believe that mother nature is God these days which I suppose is kind of pagan in a way. Although Im not christian I do like some of the "true" christian values such as "gather not the riches upon this earth for there your heart will be also" and "love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you" etc I also like some buddhist teachings.
Even though I think religion has done a lot of damage I think it would be unwise to throw the baby out with the bath water.
My favorite quote is "God has no religion" by Ghandi

[GenesisInVain]

"Dictatorial religious doctorines are harmful to minorities and majorities alike. They detract from the diversity of human experience. They create in-groups and out-groups. Devision. Isolation. 'In these things you will find salvation.' That's dangerous organised religion." I could not agree with you more Chance!

And Marly! That's a beautiful quote!

I too approach my spirituality and 'religious' beliefs with a hybrid of pantheism, paganism and Buddhist philosophy. To me the notion of love and loving 'one another as I have loved you' is more important. From love stems equality! And I think equality should reign supreme over division and isolation caused by organised religion.

This is my 'religion'/spirituality. Love is energy; it sustains all form and formlessness; our true identity. It is the glue of the Universe. It is a soul quality.

[Zakalwe]

My father was sent to a Catholic school, and being the rascal he is had the nuns try to "beat the devil out of him", he has a particular dislike for Catholics. In a way I think my parents are too pragmatic to worry about religion, and they've passed that on to my sister and I.

So consequently I have a good memetic shield against most virulent forms of religion. ;)

I think that humans tend to anthropomorphise the world around us, yet science continues to push into territory that was once occupied by religion, "god did it" inst a good enough explanation. The problem is that a lot of people find fantasy more comforting than the cold hard facts of reality.

[Anthony Mahera]

I was brought up as a Catholic (sorry, I had no choice), and I reject the idea of organised religion. I do this because organised religion can be blamed for many of the world's troubles, not just now but throughout history.
The people who organise these organised religions spout ideas on loving others until it suits them not to love.
Also, I believe that organised religion is dominated by men and even the most fashionable and groovy of them (eg. Buddhism) treat women poorly.

I hear ya. I was brought up catholic too. And I totally agree about how religion has blunndered us over the centries too, especially towards women.

[bunkoramo]

It still annoys me how politicians in the US and Australia seem to always need to have a religion. Just look at both major parties, the religious right is taking over us now.

I believe there is an important distinction to be made between religion and spirituality.

Religion I take to be concerned with belief in the claims to salvation of one faith tradition or another--an aspect of which is acceptance of some form of meta-physical or philosophical
reality, including perhaps an idea of heaven or hell. Connected with this are religious teachings or dogma, ritual, prayers and so on.

Spirituality I take to be concerned with those qualities of the human spirit--such as love and compassion, patience, tolerance, forgiveness, contentment, a sense of responsibility, a sense of harmony, which bring happiness to both self and others.
--His Holiness the Dalai Lama

Like children eventually realise that Santa doesn't exist, adults everywhere also realise that GOD doesn't exist. The desire to maintain control, position, power & privilege, keeps religious leaders & politicians using religion, as long as there are still people who will believe.
The Dalai Lama seems to be clever enough to see this, he seems to be distancing himself from being a church leader, styling himself instead as a spiritual leader, to guide people, rather than to be an authority to tell people what to do.

We are in the transition stage of moving from religious control, to Political control.

So far I think there is more good done in the name of religion, than in the name of politics.

I wonder if there might be a better system of community control than either of these two systems.

[mick65]

my place was booked in hell a long time ago, ............hang on I think I am there already

[Topher]

I was bought up catholic, but like so many others, there are too many unanswered questions.
In my younger years, I thought there were only two religions, catholic and public!
Thats what the penguins and priests had you believe.
Now there are all sorts of religions and growing.
With how 'our type' are viewed by the majority of these religions, I cannot believe that many so-called intelligent people are true believers.
Hope all goes well for the WYD, and all that protest do it non-violently.
Cheers to all!

[GenesisInVain]

Like children eventually realise that Santa doesn't exist, adults everywhere also realise that GOD doesn't exist. The desire to maintain control, position, power & privilege, keeps religious leaders & politicians using religion, as long as there are still people who will believe.
The Dalai Lama seems to be clever enough to see this, he seems to be distancing himself from being a church leader, styling himself instead as a spiritual leader, to guide people, rather than to be an authority to tell people what to do.

We are in the transition stage of moving from religious control, to Political control.

So far I think there is more good done in the name of religion, than in the name of politics.

I wonder if there might be a better system of community control than either of these two systems.

You're exactly right! I too wonder if there might be better systems of community than politics and religion but it seems that it has been institutionalised within humanity for so long, I think people would nto be able to exist. A major part of our socialisation would be lost.

[Tazia Doll]

I can tell you this for nothing, if a gay soldier is captured by the Taliban, and tells them he is gay *and* atheist, they're going to have a job on their hands to work out whether to bury him alive, or throw him off a mountain.

They keep gays in big holes, like a pit, with no ladder. They keep foreign atheists in big holes as well (with a ladder). If you are a Afghan commie, well, it is cancel that barber, because one is coming, sweeney todd time.

If they catch you with gay porn, you just don't want to know. because very upset is not the word for it. They'll close down the entire province and canvass for ideas on non-restorative justice, one is talking genuinely medieval.

Like getting mugged in Detroit

Tazia Doll

[RealMcCoy]

I can tell you this for nothing, if a gay soldier is captured by the Taliban, and tells them he is gay *and* atheist, they're going to have a job on their hands to work out whether to bury him alive, or throw him off a mountain.

They keep gays in big holes, like a pit, with no ladder. They keep foreign atheists in big holes as well (with a ladder). If you are a Afghan commie, well, it is cancel that barber, because one is coming, sweeney todd time.

If they catch you with gay porn, you just don't want to know. because very upset is not the word for it. They'll close down the entire province and canvass for ideas on non-restorative justice, one is talking genuinely medieval.

Like getting mugged in Detroit

Tazia Doll

I'm sorry - did I miss something? Was this meant to be an Islamic-bashing thread?? Were you brought up Islamic? Where are you getting your information from? Because the Islamic people I know certainly do NOT put people into holes.... care to cite some sources?

[Chancethegardener]

I can tell you this for nothing, if a gay soldier is captured by the Taliban, and tells them he is gay *and* atheist, they're going to have a job on their hands to work out whether to bury him alive, or throw him off a mountain.

They keep gays in big holes, like a pit, with no ladder. They keep foreign atheists in big holes as well (with a ladder). If you are a Afghan commie, well, it is cancel that barber, because one is coming, sweeney todd time.

If they catch you with gay porn, you just don't want to know. because very upset is not the word for it. They'll close down the entire province and canvass for ideas on non-restorative justice, one is talking genuinely medieval.

Like getting mugged in Detroit

Tazia Doll

I'd like to know your source on this...

[Tazia Doll]

Of course they don't, they don't gang-rape via reprisal in Pakistan either. I'm a pipe hitting bitch wired enough to do central Asia. I was tough enough for Harvey, Illinois & Beirut. I couldn't handle San Diego, I just don't do sailors.

[Chancethegardener]

Of course they don't, they don't gang-rape via reprisal in Pakistan either. I'm a pipe hitting bitch wired enough to do central Asia. I was tough enough for Harvey, Illinois & Beirut. I couldn't handle San Diego, I just don't do sailors.

:confused: :confused: ????????????????????????????????????? WTF?:confused: :confused:

[marly]

I'm sorry - did I miss something? Was this meant to be an Islamic-bashing thread?? Were you brought up Islamic? Where are you getting your information from? Because the Islamic people I know certainly do NOT put people into holes.... care to cite some sources?

I dont think he mentioned Islam. Hes talking Taliban. Theres no hiding the fact that the Taliban do these things and they use Islam as their excuse. I hate when people talk about Islam this way but Taliban is a completely different kettle of fish.

[Tazia Doll]

I'd like to know your source on this...
Canada in Afghanistan: The War So Far - Google Books Result by Peter Pigott - 2007 - History - 240 pages
"One group," John Fullerton recounts in The Soviet Occupation of Afghanistan, "was killed, skinned, and hung up in a butcher's shop. ...
books.google.co.uk/books?isbn=1550026747...

It is not really a Geneva accord, country.

[Tazia Doll]

:confused: :confused: ????????????????????????????????????? WTF?:confused: :confused:
I seen the hole gig with my own eyes. Afghanistan is tough on prisoners.

'Tracey Barnett: Women GIs in fear of the enemy in their army
New Zealand Herald, New Zealand - 24 Jun 2008
Her genital area showed evidence of acid, perhaps used to destroy DNA evidence. She had white military gloves glued to her burned hands. ...'

Ya won't see that either in the news in the USA, the feminists want, well it is all messed up, feminism ( a major factor) is about the rejection of all human rights values. Feminists despise kindness as patriarchal. Well they don't have to worry, there is not much of it about.

So it won't have NOW complaining, not on their agenda. Ya gotta be in a war which didn't take prisoners to have your head squared to it.

[marly]

I seen the hole gig with my own eyes. Afghanistan is tough on prisoners.

'Tracey Barnett: Women GIs in fear of the enemy in their army
New Zealand Herald, New Zealand - 24 Jun 2008
Her genital area showed evidence of acid, perhaps used to destroy DNA evidence. She had white military gloves glued to her burned hands. ...'

Ya won't see that either in the news in the USA, the feminists want, well it is all messed up, feminism ( a major factor) is about the rejection of all human rights values. Feminists despise kindness as patriarchal. Well they don't have to worry, there is not much of it about.

So it won't have NOW complaining, not on their agenda. Ya gotta be in a war which didn't take prisoners to have your head squared to it.

But then again the americans didnt treat the prisoners in abu ghraib much better did they.
There are no winners in war. Everybody loses.

[Tazia Doll]

Abu Ghraib, I knew of them from Arizona, it was the same gig there, no feminists to help me either, nor in Michigan, there were two CRIPA lawsits. I also did a jail in Pa, and one in Snohomish Wa. Abu Ghraib was too American. I woke up one day and knew, that my own tribe were, well barbarians.

http://www.hrw.org/reports/1996/Us1.htm

I wake up, and I give no excuse for complaint. I treat folks the way I want to be, treated. Except to the urban patois of Jay Z

I keep saying there is no 'gub' in government, it doesn't have to be the Queen's English, what with Yorktown and everything, but it does have to be English. We are all entitled to the odd prejudice.

99 probs and a jammed 9 has been one of dem.

[bunkoramo]

Since everyone is exposed to the religion of there parents & community, from birth.
We don't have any choice, as we grow we may learn a little about other religions, but most people know almost nothing about most other religions.
So we have little knowledge to base a free choice decision on, when we are mature age.
To me it means that it is not any individuals fault or choice which religion is followed.
It therefore makes no sense to me to hate people because they were taught to follow a different religion than you were.
Thats why I believe most people who use religious hatred have a hidden agenda.
Religion is is just used as an excuse to justify their actions.
The truth is more likely to be the desire for power, wealth, privilege, etc.
Their true religion is more likely to be worshipping the green monster.
It is a sad fact of human nature, those that are honest and caring of other people, are overshadowed.

[marly]

Since everyone is exposed to the religion of there parents & community, from birth.
We don't have any choice, as we grow we may learn a little about other religions, but most people know almost nothing about most other religions.
So we have little knowledge to base a free choice decision on, when we are mature age.
To me it means that it is not any individuals fault or choice which religion is followed.
It therefore makes no sense to me to hate people because they were taught to follow a different religion than you were.
Thats why I believe most people who use religious hatred have a hidden agenda.
Religion is is just used as an excuse to justify their actions.
The truth is more likely to be the desire for power, wealth, privilege, etc.
Their true religion is more likely to be worshipping the green monster.
It is a sad fact of human nature, those that are honest and caring of other people, are overshadowed.

Very wise words Bunkorama:)

[zebra-stripes]

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1275/610765646_ee26c98eca.jpg?v=1182688807

[zebra-stripes]

http://photos-f.ak.facebook.com/photos-ak-sf2p/v149/78/30/501420794/n501420794_662141_4013.jpg

[omphaloskeptic]

Can I urge people to mark themselves as 'No Religion' in the next census? One of the main reasons why the NSW Govt gave 86 mill to the Catholic Church for WYD is because Catholic is apparently the main religious denomination in Australia. My feeling is that most people are non-religious despite their upbringing, baptism, whatever, and should stand up to be counted.

[chad_74]

does
"cock worship"
count as a religion?

[Tazia Doll]

Can I urge people to mark themselves as 'No Religion' in the next census? One of the main reasons why the NSW Govt gave 86 mill to the Catholic Church for WYD is because Catholic is apparently the main religious denomination in Australia. My feeling is that most people are non-religious despite their upbringing, baptism, whatever, and should stand up to be counted.

Yeah, it's like being a gay, a matter of circumstances. People like being Catholic, it is like that Irish or Italian thing, it's not like being Lutheran, it's worth throwing a party for. Catholics are attacked by lunatic & ersatz-gays all the time, that Frisco stuff was well out of order, if they'd tried it in LA, the cops would have beaten heck out of them and they would have deserved it.

[Chancethegardener]

Being gay is a matter of circumstance?!

I don't understand what you mean by ersatz-gays? I know what ersatz means, just not in the context you used it. Do you mean non-gay people who protest for gay rights/causes? And if so, they deserve to 'have the heck beaten out of them?'

I'm having trouble understanding your posts in general...

[RealMcCoy]

Being gay is a matter of circumstance?!

I don't understand what you mean by ersatz-gays? I know what ersatz means, just not in the context you used it. Do you mean non-gay people who protest for gay rights/causes? And if so, they deserve to 'have the heck beaten out of them?'

I'm having trouble understanding your posts in general...

That's because you are assuming his posts make any sense.....

Please don't feed the troll! It will only encourage it to stay... ;-)

[Chancethegardener]

That's because you are assuming his posts make any sense.....

Please don't feed the troll! It will only encourage it to stay... ;-)

Understood! ;)

[Tazia Doll]

Being gay is a matter of circumstance?!

I don't understand what you mean by ersatz-gays? I know what ersatz means, just not in the context you used it. Do you mean non-gay people who protest for gay rights/causes? And if so, they deserve to 'have the heck beaten out of them?'

I'm having trouble understanding your posts in general...

Targeting the Catholics in San Francisco, has repercussions in Poland & Chicago, Philly, New York City etc. I decided what I was. Ersatz is that rainbow coalition thing, ya know, any old hobby that wants to join.

The decline of sexual radicalism in The Netherlands

Noordanus stated "homo*sexuality does not exist", meaning there was no separate homo- or hete*rosexual iden*tity.

http://www2.fmg.uva.nl/gl/radsex.html

The old timers didn't do born girlie, they just tried to take over the whole world. I'm just a genetically controversial kind of bitch. I was sexual liberation in the DDR, & Slovakia, I missed out Poland. I almost done Siberia, and thank goodness I didn't.

Central Asia, Beirut, I also did. I was a real commie faggot.

[Tazia Doll]

"That's because you are assuming his posts make any sense....."

Well if ya do rude, do it properly. Maybe they don't make sense, like in a bus-station, you hear some kraut-volga dialect, who can ever put that together. Like the sov soldiers who stayed in Aghanisatan, or the French who couldn't bear to leave Russia to see a France without Napoleon, nevre assume you have the key to somebody's head or some Jap in the jungle, I am one of those people, by the time I escaped my war, there was nothing there to call home. Think of me as an old person, you kids chill out.

[Thrawn04]

But then again the americans didnt treat the prisoners in abu ghraib much better did they.
There are no winners in war. Everybody loses.

So true... When will we learn? :confused:
Such a shame that it's part of human nature... :(

[omphaloskeptic]

Tazia, I'm going to politely ignore you until you can string together sentences that make sense, or at least have grammatical sense. Actually, are you using a computer program constructing random sentences from random words?

[Tazia Doll]

Tazia, I'm going to politely ignore you until you can string together sentences that make sense, or at least have grammatical sense. Actually, are you using a computer program constructing random sentences from random words?


You wouldn't collect match-boxes by any chance? If you are ignoring me why are you replying, or is it aspiratonal or something?

"are you using a computer program constructing random sentences from random words"

Is that a Kim Philby joke?

[GenesisInVain]

feminism ( a major factor) is about the rejection of all human rights values. Feminists despise kindness as patriarchal.

are you serious?

Its the rejection of all human rights values?

What support do you have to say such a statement?

So in your opnion itt really hasn't contributed to achieve some equality (because full equality hasn't been achieved yet)
for woemn over the last 100 years?

[GenesisInVain]

feminism ( a major factor) is about the rejection of all human rights values. Feminists despise kindness as patriarchal.

are you serious?

Its the rejection of all human rights values?

What support do you have to say such a statement?

So in your opnion itt really hasn't contributed to achieve some equality (because full equality hasn't been achieved yet)
for women over the last 100 years?

[Flashfire]

I come from a Catholic family but it was really complicated. My grandfather had been excommunicated for marrying a Protestant and refusing to raise his children Catholic. My grandparents allowed their children to chose the church they wished to attend. So my family was a mix of Catholic, Church of England, Baptist and Methodist. My mother was Church of England, but I was not raised as such, my mother allowed me to choose when I was pre adolescent. I actually wanted to join the Salvation Army, but for some reason they were not acceptable to my family and so I was baptised Catholic at the age of 11 years, same as my grandfather and eldest aunt. I fell in love with the idea of being a Nun and started going to Mass I took Holy Communion and was on my way to Confirmation. Then I decided that I didnt want to be a Nun anymore and I lost interest in going to church, it was pretty boring anyway. So I have never had a problem with ingrained belief systems that I had to overcome.

Somewhere along the way, I ended up deciding that god didnt exist anyway and religion is all about control of the masses. I think I was reading Marx at the time.

Now I just get into silly online discussions with the holier than thou hypocrites who want to control my life and my sexuality with their outmoded sense of morality.

[Tazia Doll]

are you serious?

Its the rejection of all human rights values?

What support do you have to say such a statement?

So in your opnion itt really hasn't contributed to achieve some equality (because full equality hasn't been achieved yet)
for woemn over the last 100 years?


I'm talking about westernized concepts. Feminism, what did it do for RAWA, or against the girl-burners of Basra, or for

http://www.lavenajohnson.com/

It is more interested in getting girls into the military than getting them out.

We have male guards watching female inmates shower in prisons all over the world because of feminism. As for sex-posi-fem, that's the Jew the Nazis allowed to live to trap other Jews.

Feminism is a cruel thing, as in pain, intolerance, anti-family, and anti-God. Don't get me wrong, I don't see too many Laura Bush soccer Mom outfits opening any girls riding schools in Afghanistan either.

Catharine Lumby is ( in my opinion) the icky face of pseudo-feminism in Oz. But generaly speaking feminists are the worse bigots one will ever meet.

Lumby is also a bit of a complete idiot.

Two major failings there.

Tazia Doll

[Tazia Doll]

"Now I just get into silly online discussions with the holier than thou hypocrites who want to control my life and my sexuality with their outmoded sense of morality."

I was selling the concept of methamphetamine as a religion in east Berlin when people were still driving cardboard cars.

I was light on moralism, and heavy on the snare drum. I don't come to a debate with a white hat, I ran great clubs, and if I did anything, it was fun, I threw 'tunnel parties' or 'bring your own spade' gigs in east Berlin, I hired lighting rigs and loudspeakers for 'the other side' of the wall.

I got away with it because the commies needed me.

the biggest downer of my life, was the invention of the CD, a part of me, just withered.

I grew up wanting to run a major record corporation, and by the time I made that happen, nobody wanted to make records.

I use to sit at the bottom of my huge building stuffing vinyl and notes into album sleeves. I would listen to students on part-time jobs talking about 'the cold' and I would order ten frigging heaters, and

What is it about, an album sleeve, well history, continuity, I'll tell you, I worked in the debris of production talent, and I mean lacquers, metal-parts, stampers and lathes, dating to the 1930s. That was the real phonograph business.

How many people on this forum can remember PYE or DECCA when they were real companies? When Germain Greer was in that Pheasantry gaff writing the Female Freak or whatever it was.

Morality, that's a bourgeois thing, the rich don't need it, and the poor can't afford it.

Tazia Doll

[Flashfire]

[I]
Morality, that's a bourgeois thing, the rich don't need it, and the poor can't afford it.

Tazia Doll


Actually I think there is a place for morality, but its more personal rather than the societal concept of morality.

[GenesisInVain]

I'm talking about westernized concepts. Feminism, what did it do for RAWA, or against the girl-burners of Basra, or for

http://www.lavenajohnson.com/

It is more interested in getting girls into the military than getting them out.

We have male guards watching female inmates shower in prisons all over the world because of feminism. As for sex-posi-fem, that's the Jew the Nazis allowed to live to trap other Jews.

Feminism is a cruel thing, as in pain, intolerance, anti-family, and anti-God. Don't get me wrong, I don't see too many Laura Bush soccer Mom outfits opening any girls riding schools in Afghanistan either.

Catharine Lumby is ( in my opinion) the icky face of pseudo-feminism in Oz. But generaly speaking feminists are the worse bigots one will ever meet.

Lumby is also a bit of a complete idiot.

Two major failings there.

Tazia Doll

I'm sorry I don't seem to follow you, you're not making sense.

Of course there will be failings. Not every "ism" achieves all its purposes.
And you won't see girl riding schools in Afghanistan because the religion of Islam oppresses feminism as it is seen as a Western 'devil'.

"But generaly speaking feminists are the worse bigots one will ever meet."
I stand to contradict you. Religious extremists and fundamentalists are the worst bigots.

[jackie87]

http://www.news.com.au/feature/ranked/0,,5016937,00.html

very interesting discussion on different religions and World Youth Day

[Tazia Doll]

I'm sorry I don't seem to follow you, you're not making sense.

Of course there will be failings. Not every "ism" achieves all its purposes.
And you won't see girl riding schools in Afghanistan because the religion of Islam oppresses feminism as it is seen as a Western 'devil'.

"But generaly speaking feminists are the worse bigots one will ever meet."
I stand to contradict you. Religious extremists and fundamentalists are the worst bigots.



I've got news for ya babe, NATO, US, Oz, Britain they all oppress feminism in Afghanistan. The other prob,, feminism has, it is a philosophy without guns, here is what I know, it is always a downer to be the only clown in town without a piece.

Tazia Doll

[GenesisInVain]

I've got news for ya babe, NATO, US, Oz, Britain they all oppress feminism in Afghanistan. The other prob,, feminism has, it is a philosophy without guns, here is what I know, it is always a downer to be the only clown in town without a piece.

Tazia Doll

"I've got news for ya babe, NATO, US, Oz, Britain they all oppress feminism in Afghanistan". Please provide some evidence of this.

A philosophy without guns... As in violence? And androcentric war?